Table of Contents
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The Bible:  Worthy of Your Trust?


Eyewitness Testimony Invalidated

     Responses to Eyewitness Testimony Invalidated

God Is Not The Author

History or HIS-STORY?

How Firm A Foundation... of Forgeries???

James the Brother of Jesus

Schizophrenia and Personal Revelations

     Responses to Schizophrenia




The God of The Bible

Biblegod Is Not Perfect

    Responses to Biblegod Not Perfect

Biblegod The Warcriminal

    Responses to Biblegod
The Warcriminal


Tyrannosaurus Pettius Rex

Jehovah Unmasked

In or Out or Neit
her


Acts of God

September 11th Biblegod Did Nothing

    Responses to September 11th




The God of The Bible:
Does He Exist?

E=MC Disproves God

    Responses to E=MC

How To Prove The Existence of God

    Responses to How To Prove The Existence of God

Shopping For A God

Transcendental La La Land




Caught in a Lie:  Contradictions Within The Bible

Don't Be Such A Cretan

The Genealogy of Jesus

Galilee vs Jerusalem

Matthew vs John

Intrinsic Contradictions

Splainin To Do

The Intercontinental Ballistic Jesus

The Sign on The Cross

     Responses to The Sign on The Cross




Sand, Not Rock:  What Christianity is Really Built Upon

The Atonement

Monotheism Not Biblical

The Ten Commandments

Christianity Has Pagan DNA

Faith

Misc. Topics & Thoughts




Jesus:  False Prophet?


False Prophet- Liar, Fraud!

 If Anybody Else But Jesus…

 Jesus and His Expired Prophecies

Matthew 24 Verse by Verse

Mt 24:34 What The Scholars Say

Significance of Jesus Being a False Prophet

Preterism

     Responses to Jesus The False Prophet




Jesus:  Resurrected?

Even If True

Evidence That Doesn't Demand a Verdict

The Roman Soldiers: "We Were There!"

     Responses to Roman Soldiers




Churchianity Examined

Connecting The Dots

The Authority Totem

Twenty Percent Fewer Errors

Fire The Clergy

     Responses to Fire The Clergy

The Wealth of Churches

Authority In Church Government

The Fleecing of The Flock

The Great Commission Does Not Apply




CAUTIONChristianity May Be Hazardous to Your Health

Victims of Religion

   Responses to Victims of Religion

Voices In Our Head

Brainwashing

   Responses to Brainwashing

We Love Our Lies




Christian Morality or Lack Thereof 

Christianity Doesn't Work as Advertised

Hypocrisy- Thy Name is Christian

Morality

The Gospel of Jesus

 Happy Father's Day

He Wasn't a REAL Christian




Evangelical Atheism

Free JCnot4me Business Cards
JCnot4me Business Cards- FREE!

Without A Leg To Stand On (A Message For Freethinkers)

Give To Him That Asks

   Responses to Give To Him That Asks

Just Say No

   Responses to Just Say No

Damn The Truth- Full Speed Ahead

Answering Christian Stock Arguments

Modern Miracle Workers

Atheists In America

Anti-Religious Songs

Do Unto Others

Kissing Hank's Ass

Why Beer Is Better Than Jesus

Poster: Jesus is a Liar & Lunatic

The Good News of Atheism

The Skeptic’s Prayer

What Would Jesus Do?




Christian Cults

Consumers Guide to Religion- John Cleese of Monty Python (audio file)

Geek Speak Like a Fundy

   Responses to Geek Speak 101

How To Be a Fundy

-----

Baptists} Once Saved, Always Saved: Always False

Catholics: Only Child or Eldest Brother

Church of Christ

   Responses to Church of Christ Essays

Dr. Robert Schuller: Racism By A Nose

Jehovah Witnesses

Nazarenes} Entire Sanctification = Entire Nonsense

   Responses to Entire Sactification

Mormons

Seventh Day Adventists




For Christians...

Message to Christian Apologists

Notes to Christians Battling Atheists

Move A Mountain

Hope

Ex-Christians Get No Respect

Abortion

Hellfire For Homosexuals and Roses




Creationism, aka Intelligent Design

The Universe According To The Bible

   Responses to The Universe

In The Beginning God Was Nuts

Intelligent Design




Politics

Legalize Prostitution

Its The Economy, Stupid

Illegal Immigration

Bush Is Outta Here!!!

The Bush Monkey

Twilights Last Gleaming




Contra Craig
    (Dr. William Lane Craig)


Contra Craig

   Responses to Contra Craig




Misc.

Editorials

   Responses To Editorials

Comments to JCnot4me- Pro + Con

One Picture is Worth...

Links- Other Websites Worth Checking Out




Books You Should Read   

Jehovah Unmasked cover
Jehovah Unmasked




Ha Ha Ha

Christian Election Poster

Flying Spaghetti Monster

Invitation from Rev. Jim Jones

Jokes

Pranks

Songs and Poems




 





 

Once Saved, Always Saved:  Always False.

(1977, 1993    Mark Smith)

 

Certain Christian sects, especially the Baptists,  teach a doctrine called “Eternal Security”,  commonly referred to as “Once Saved, Always Saved.” Many non-Baptists criticize it as a moral blank check that encourages Baptists  to do as they please, since their “salvation” from BibleGod’s hell is  never in jeopardy, as they can do whatever the hell they want, and never “go to hell”. This may indeed be an issue, but in my opinion, this problem is not limited to the Baptist sect. Christianity in general offers “blank check” morality, as Christians (in their worldview) are allowed to get away with any atrocity- even the genocide of six million Jews, as long as they utter a trite “Awww gee, sorry, Jesus” afterwards. And that’s all it would have taken Adolf to ensure his future entry into “heaven”.  Christianity, in offering such cheap and easy moral forgiveness, leads to the moral breakdown of a society, rather than to the moral strengthening. Atheism on the other hand, leads to personal moral responsibility, as we have no such easy out for our screwups. 

 

 

As juicy as the above issues are, they shall await a future essay. For right now, the question that this essay deals with is the fact that this doctrine of “Once Saved Always Saved”  goes against clear Bible teaching.  And this leads one to wonder, whenever one encounters yet another Baptist trying to shove his Bible and its gods down someone’s throat, since the Baptists themselves don’t listen to their own Bible, 

 Why the hell should we???

 

 

*************************

 

 

“All that the Father gives Me shall come to Me; and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out.”  John 6:37

Jesus, in this verse, says that he will not cast out people that come to him. But this verse does not preclude people casting themselves out by their own free will. BibleGod would not hold a man in BibleGod’s kingdom against that man’s will, neither would he send a man to heaven against that man’s will. That would be spiritual slavery/kidnapping.

 

 

“...and I give eternal life to them; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of My hand.”  John 10:28

The verse preceding this one in the Bible (#27, see above) lays down a prerequisite of life-long obedience by saying that “they follow Me.” Given that obedience, verse 28 promises security. Notice the “they” of #28 refers directly back to the “they” of #27. So this section, in its whole, in CONTEXT, says that THEY who FOLLOW Jesus shall never perish. It follows then, that they who CEASE to follow Jesus also cease to be covered by the reward of never perishing.

 

 

 

“...nothing...shall be able to separate us from the love of God...”  Romans 8:39

This verse does not say that “nothing will be able to take away our salvation.” It only says that BibleGod will continue to love you wherever you end up- even in hell. You can never be separated from the love of BibleGod- even if you end up being separated from his salvation. Even Baptists will admit that sinners are not separated from the love of BibleGod, though they are separated from his salvation. In other words, this verse doesn’t support their theory.

 

 

 

“The Christian is one who has been born again, born of the Spirit of God, born into the kingdom of God. He becomes a child of God by reason of the new birth. When a child is born to a father and mother, he can never cease to be their child.”  

(Soul Winning Doctrines, J. Clyde Turner, Convention Press, 1955, Nashville, page 81)

 

It is obvious that Mr. Turner has never thought about the term ADOPTION, nor about the concept of a parent DISOWNING a child. If a man is a child of the devil, and through the “New Birth” becomes adopted into BibleGod’s family, he becomes equal to any of BibleGod’s regular children, though by birth he remains the child of the devil. In fact, according to the Bible, all Christians are adopted children of BibleGod, and not natural children (see Romans 8:15&23, 9:4, Galatians 4:5, Eph. 1:5). And as anyone  knows, children who can be adopted can be UN-adopted just as easily. (See Romans 11:19-22 for more detail.)

 

 

 

“But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has DENIED THE FAITH, and is WORSE THAN AN UNBELIEVER.”  1 Tim. 5:8

If it is with difficulty that the righteous are saved (1 Peter 4:18), “...what will become of the Godless man and the sinner...” or of the man who is WORSE than a sinner, worse than an unbeliever???  It is obvious that man will roast in the BibleGod’s eternal hell fire, Christian or not.

 

 

 

“...keeping faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and suffered shipwreck in regard to their faith.”  1 Tim. 1:19

One can not sail to heaven in a ship that has wrecked and sunk to the bottom. If the Christian suffers a loss of faith, that is, if he ceases to trust Jesus, whether it be through contradictions among the gospels, or false second coming prophecies, his faith may suffer shipwreck, and he will then be eternally tormented and burned alive for ever and ever by his loving heavenly  father. (With fathers like this, who needs enemies???) 

 

 

 

“For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit (i.e. these were spirit filled 100% pure Christians) and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, it is IMPOSSIBLE to renew them again to repentance while they again crucify to themselves the Son of God, and put Him to open shame...if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, AND ENDS UP BEING BURNED.”   Hebrews 6:4-8

These people were partakers of the Holy Spirit, which, according to Paul in Romans 8: 9,ll meant they were saved at one time. This point needs to be established as some Baptists claim people who lose their salvation were “never REALLY saved in the first place.”

This verse clearly shows that these people used to be Holy Spirit filled saved and empowered Christians, then turned away from the faith, and now are going to end up being burned in hell by the god of all love and kindness. It can’t get any clearer than that. This verse disproves with a vengeance the notion that a Christian can not end up in hell. 

 

 

 

“He who overcomes shall thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My father, and before His angels.” Rev. 3:5

A Christian must “overcome” to PREVENT his name from being erased from the book of life. This shows that Christians who DON’T overcome won’t be saved, and it also shows that Jesus does indeed have the power to erase people’s names from the roll of the saved, and indeed WILL erase the names of those who did not overcome. Jesus would not have created an “eraser” unless he was going to use it. The very fact that an “eraser” exists disproves the ��Once Saved, Always Saved�� fantasy.

 

 

 

“And those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy: and these have no firm root; they BELIEVE for a while, and in time of temptation fall away.” Luke 8:13

Jesus says they believed. Paul said those who believe became saved, (Acts 16:31) Therefore, these people were at one time saved. They also later “fell away.” Fell away from what? From their salvation, of course!

 

 

 

"If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away as a branch, and dries up; and they gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."  John 15:6

“Thrown away” from their salvation is all that makes sense, as “does not abide IN me” implies that at one time they WERE 

 “in him.” One can not cease to abide in something one  was never in, in the first place. So, once again, another example of Christians ending up in hell (note what Jesus said about the fire- if that’s not referring to hell, what is?) via their loving, kind, all merciful father in heaven.

 

 

 

“But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves...For if after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, THE LAST STATE HAS BECOME WORSE  THAN THE FIRST. For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment delivered to them. It has happened to them according to the true proverb, ‘A dog returns to its own vomit,’ and, ‘A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire.’”  2 Peter 2:1, 20-22

Peter mentions that these ex-Christians had “denied the master who bought them.” Note that the phrase “bought them” is reflected in 1 Cor. 6:19,20, where Paul says:

 

“Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own? For you have been bought with a price...”

As previously shown, the New Testament teaches that if a man is a Christian, and has the Holy Spirit, he is a “real” Christian no ifs, ands, or buts. I am again establishing the fact that the Bible teaches that “real” Christians CAN have their salvation jerked away by BibleGod. These people who had been “bought with a price,” and who’s bodies were “temples of the Holy Spirit,” nevertheless are now UNsaved. For, if their “first state” was to have been unsaved, and now that they have rejected Jesus, their current state is WORSE than their first state, they must be even worse than unsaved!!! So, dear Baptists, how can they still be saved if they are in a worse state than being unsaved? They are so far down BibleGod’s shit-list that even the initially UNsaved have more status than they.

 

“You have been   SEVERED   FROM CHRIST,  you who are seeking to be justified by  law; you have  FALLEN  FROM GRACE.”  Galatians 5:4

In the original Greek, the word “severed” means: 

“To be severed from, separated from, discharged from, loosed from any one. To terminate all intercourse with one.” (Thayer’s Greek-English Lexicon). 

Another book, Vine’s Expository Dictionary, puts it this way: 

“...they were as branches severed from the tree.”  

And The New English Bible words it as  “completely severed.”

 

Based upon all this, the following three points can be made:

1.   To have been SEVERED from the TREE, they therefore must have at one time been ATTACHED to the TREE. In other words, yes, these people were previously saved.

 

2.   Since these people had been SEVERED from Christ, and since there is “salvation in no one else” (Acts 4:12), they must therefore have been SEVERED from their SALVATION!!! Do you get it, Baptists??? Severed from Christ  =  Severed from Salvation. Is it really that hard to see, or do you Baptists just love your traditions (and traditional doctrines) more than you love your gods???

 

3.   Paul said they had “fallen from grace.” This implies they must have been IN grace (i.e. saved) in order to FALL FROM IT. It would be impossible to have “fallen from an airplane” unless one were IN the airplane to start with. In other words, yes, once again, an example of 

“REAL 100% Christians” having LOST their salvation. (How many examples are needed to convince a Baptist that it’s possible for a person to have “really been saved,” and then to have REALLY LOST HIS SALVATION???)

 

Anyway, since it is “by grace you have been saved,” (Eph. 2:8) and since these people had “fallen from grace,” (Gal.  5:4), and since there is “salvation in no one else,” (Acts 4:12) and as these ex-Christians had been “severed from Christ,” (Gal. 5:4), severed from the one and only source of salvation in the universe, by what means Dear Baptists, if these people are STILL SAVED, by what means other than Christ (from whom they are separated) are they now being saved??? They are severed from Christ and severed from grace. But you say they are saved.  You must be advocating then a means of salvation that doesn’t need either Christ or grace. By what means then are these people NOW being saved??? What are the details- the “nuts and bolts” of this theory??? Are they being saved by BUDDHA  maybe? Because according to your Bible, it sure ain’t by Jesus anymore!!!  Maybe you should read your Bible once in a while- you know, practice what you preach. What a concept!

 

 

 

“Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men...but   *whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit NEVER HAS FORGIVENESS, but is guilty of an ETERNAL SIN.”  Mark 3:28,29

*Even a Christian.

 

“For if you forgive men for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men, then your Father will NOT FORGIVE YOUR TRANSGRESSIONS.” Matthew 6:14,15

Let’s suppose that while reading the Old Testament one day, a Christian gets really angry at BibleGod for all the innocent men and women, children, and even unborn, that were murdered because that was what BibleGod commanded the Jews to do. (See Exodus 32:27, or Exodus 20:5, or Hosea 13:16, or Numbers 31:15-18) And let’s suppose that he gets so mad at BibleGod that he blasphemes both BibleGod and the Holy Spirit of BibleGod. And also, as the anger builds, he refuses to forgive the minister who couldn’t explain away all the atrocities of this God of “love.”

Now, according to the words of Jesus, this man will never receive forgiveness for these sins. Which means that these sins will always be on his hands. And since BibleGod will not tolerate sin in his heaven, this Christian must end up in the other place after he dies. This would be a very clear case of a Christian losing his faith through Bible study, and thus also losing his salvation. A perfect example of the falsity of “once saved, always saved.”

 

 

“I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If ANYONE adds to them, God shall add to him the plagues which are written in this book; AND IF ANYONE  (Hey Baptists! Does the word “Anyone” also include saved Baptists???) takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, GOD SHALL TAKE AWAY HIS PART FROM THE TREE OF LIFE AND FROM THE HOLY CITY, which are written in this book.”  Revelation 22: 18&19

Well, gee, this sure sounds to me like a clear refutation of the “once saved, always saved”  party line. It does say “anyone,” which would include even Baptist Christians. And it does say that these Christians were saved- they had their part of the tree of life already reserved. And then it goes on to say that BibleGod would CANCEL their reservation and keep them out of heaven, out of the “holy city.” Unless, of course, the Baptists have a special heaven all to themselves where they don’t need the “tree of life” to live forever, and don’t need to live in the “holy city” with BibleGod. In fact, maybe the Baptists are actually planning to boycott heaven just like they boycotted Disney World, because BibleGod has been too inclusive of people they don’t like. Maybe they DO have their own secret heaven???

 

 

 

“Every one who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.”   1 John 3:15

“Everyone” here includes saved Christians. Even the idea of hating “his brother” would indicate this is directed towards inter-Christian relationships. A Christian would not refer to a Pagan as his “brother”, but rather to a fellow Christian. And it says that the Christian who hates his brother has no eternal life. He was saved, then he hated his brother in Christ, and now as a result he has become UNsaved.  

 

*********************************

 

I hope that this study will come in useful. It would be good to use in deflating any Baptist friends who are bugging you to buy into their myth. And you could even quote to them the Bible (not that it would do any good, though- remember, these are HARD SHELLED Baptists!), as it is written in Hebrews 3:12

"Take care, brethren, lest there

should be in any one of you

an evil unbelieving heart, 

in falling away from the living God."

 

*********************************

 

 

 


 

 Links to Other Web Sites dealing with "Once Saved, Always Saved"

 

http://www.geocities.com/1christlover/OSAS-.html 

 

http://www.webspawner.com/users/eternalosas/index.html

 

 

Contact Information for Mark Smith

Set Free!
Orange County, CA

Email     JCnot4me@aol.com

Web Page     JCnot4me.com

NOTICE:  Any and all emails sent to SET FREE become the property of SET FREE to be used or displayed upon the web site of SET FREE however SET FREE decides. Views contained in SET FREE represent the views of the authors. No implicit approval by SET FREE is to be assumed.

 

 








Contact Information

Set Free!  Orange County, CA

Email:     JCnot4me@aol.com             Web Page     JCnot4me.com

NOTICE:  Any and all emails sent to SET FREE become the property of SET FREE to be used or displayed upon the web site of SET FREE however SET FREE decides, but don't worry,  your email address will probably be deleted.   Views contained in SET FREE represent the views of the authors. No implicit approval by SET FREE is to be assumed.